You would be better off having the dealer do it while in warranty for piece of mind. Sure, you can document it and in theory should be OK.... but if you need to make a claim on the engine you will be sweating it out!

I can tell you the splash guard is a PITA to remove as there are so many fasteners.

 

I don't find the splash guard a PITA to remove and I also don't have a lot of faith in the workmanship of the dealership.
The first oil change there was the last. 4 of the 17 fasteners were missing when I did the second oil change.

Receipts for a factory filter, the correct API rated oil and a date and mileage log is all you need. No theory involved.
For added measure I take a picture of the odometer, the products and the vehicle on ramps. The images provide a date and time stamp.

 

As far as oil changes going, I don't know how you don't feel the splash guard is a PITA. 17 fasteners is about double any car I have had before but whatever. It takes longer to mess around with the tray than it would to change the oil.

I used to document my oil changes like you described on my Saabaru but when we got our Audi I was afraid I may have issues (which we did.... BIG ONES). I don't trust the dealers/car companies to do the right thing when they are going to cover many thousands of dollars in repairs. Yes, in theory they have to but they can make it VERY difficult for you. It would be easy to get lazy/lose a receipt or pictures over a 100,000 mile period.

If they deny your claim, you may win in the end after getting a lawyer but for me having the oil changed at the dealer is cheap insurance. My dealer only charges $45 for an oil change and tire rotation with a coupon. For me it is a no brainer but I appreciate some live far from dealers and it is a royal PITA so doing it at home saves a lot of time/aggravation.

 

The idea that an OEM can deny warranty claims because a private shop or owner does his or her own work is not correct, including oil changes.

 

I posted the procedure a while ago (search my posts). It is fairly painless if you've got a nutdriver or small impact gun to remove all the belly pan bolts. I think it took me 15 minutes from start to finish with ramps and a creeper.

Best,

 

Thanks, I agree, I don't trust the dealer to do any quality work, I'll only go to them for warranty work. Agreed on simply documenting any work and there will be no issue with warranty.

 

Are you really that confident? You saying there will be no issue with the warranty doesn't mean anything to KIA lol. Who are you? Sure, you may win in the end (after a HUGE inconvenience and possible legal fees) but for me there is more piece of mind having the dealer service the car while in warranty (at least oil changes and ideally coolant and transmission fluid if applicable too). If they do something wrong while servicing the car, you aggressively deal with it from multiple angles and I doubt you ever have a problem again.

A quick Google search would bring up several stories similar to the one below and indicate that you a rolling the dice..... I don't care what you think and what is "right". In the real world, things may not go smoothly and that is why I have all fluids changed by the dealer and on time/under mileage so is something goes wrong, there is no BS!

And when you say you don't trust the dealer to do any quality work but you would trust them to warranty work? That sounds really odd to me as the warranty work is usually way more involved than a simple oil change.

https://www.reddit.com/r/legaladvice/comments/5vl8k4/kia_is_denying_warranty_trying_to_charge_6700/

Kia is denying warranty, trying to charge $6700
2015 optima with about 36k miles. Engine seized shortly after a DIY oil change(Jan 20). After being towed to the dealer they "diagnosed" bearing failure (I put that in quotes because all the guy did was take 2 minutes and put a wrench on the crankshaft pulley and try to rotate it). Since I didn't have oil receipts on me they were going to charge $6700 to replace the engine. So I decided to fight it. Got in touch with kia consumer affairs, which went nowhere. Apparently they refuse to acknowledge the magnuson-moss warranty act, whereby the MUST PROVE that I caused the failure. After sending some complaints out, I was contacted by Megan in the escalations dept. She began working with the dealership on the issue. 1st excuse to deny warranty: lack of maintentance receipts. Apparently they don't understand that a lack of receipts does not mean a lack of maintenance. So I was able to scrounge up a few and send them to the service manager at the dealership. More on this later.

2nd excuse: there must be oil sludge in the engine. Sales manager pulled the valve cover and sent in pictures. In his words, there is no sign of a lack of maintenance, the engine is free of sludge and carbon build up. It appears brand new. Oops kia, that didn't work. So they are trying this next one.

3rd excuse: use of non-oem fluids and filter. I use amsoil 5w20, receipts verify this. Owner's manual specifies 5w20 oil with a rating of API SM and/or ILSAC GF-4. Amsoil holds an API SN and ILSAC GF-5 rating, both superior to oem. The filter is purolator one, rated for 10k miles, same spring relief pressure as oem, high density synthetic blend material, and is made by MANN who makes the oem filter! Oops again kia.

I have been able to find three more oil receipts, bringing the total to five. The change interval is 7500 miles. Including the last change (six) I am well within the interval specified in the manual.

At this point I'm ready to buy a complete engine for $1700 and put it in myself. This puts me $5000 under their quote, which is absurd. If I have to do that I'll take them to small claims court for the maximum penalty in Florida. Right now all they've offered to do is waive the labor costs, still putting me at around $3800. They have still failed to prove I am at fault for the failure (because I'm not) and therefore have no right to deny warranty.

Any thoughts on additional recourse? I have been without a car for over a month now that I am still making payments on.

Update: this keeps getting views and votes so I guess I should provide a status report. After multiple emails to the vp of warranty affairs with no response, I replaced the engine myself for $1500. 14k miles later, there are no issues, and the replacement motor (canadian) runs stronger and gets better mileage.

Oddly enough kia issued a recall for this very issue but conveniently stopped with the 2014 model year. I never miss an opportunity to bash the company and their product publicly.

 

Thanks, I found the thread where you describe what you did. Appreciate the reply.

 

It's easy to cut out holes on that cover.

 

I had 3 issues with my 03. Sorie. One was the infamous butterfly issue and the 2nd was the center support bearing. 3rd was the coolant reservoir leak. All three went off without a hitch. I did all my own maintenance. I kept a top off the oil filter box with a date and a receipt stapled to it. That receipt also recorded the oil purchased. They were surprised when I handed them a copy of an Excel program with all of my work and when it was performed. It took two weeks from the time it was towed to the time the work was performed(butterfly issue). Less time on driveshaft and coolant bottle. I also did not use OEM filters for the most part.
It can be done with proper paper work and patience.

 

Brian,

Do you know how many people change their own oil and filter on recently purchased vehicles? OEMs have no legal precedent for denying warranty claims if owners do their work / maintenance (with proper documentation). I've worked for two OEMs and a third party auto publication.

And yes I bring my vehicles to a trusted private mechanic for work that I cannot complete. If warranty work needs to happen at a dealer then I will research the best Service department in my area and of course bring the vehicle in for service.

 

I'll let the dealer do my first oil / filter change. Some warranty work is needed anyway at that time.

Then bring in home and replace the oil with synthetic and replace any missing fasteners.
Second and later oil changes, don't know yet...

 

No doubt many people change their own oil and many have no had issue with warranty claims. That being said, there are many accounts online of people doing their own oil changes and having difficulty getting a claim covered. The concern would be for something failing related to engine oil, not something like a coolant reservoir or say a coil pack failing.

Like I said, you are rolling the dice. The odds may not be terrible, but it is a risk I rather not deal with. It is a personal choice but there is nothing wrong having this discussion as it would be foolish to not consider the various outcomes ahead of time and to trying to convince yourself or others that you will be 100% OK is foolish.

 

. The concern would be for something failing related to engine oil, not something like a coolant reservoir or say a coil pack failing.

Not true. When my butterflies went south for the winter(not oil or lube related) they still wanted all my maintenance records. I questioned that part and they told me it doesn't matter.
Warranty claims is a position of you are guilty until you prove it is their fault.

 

I do 2 out of every 3 oil changes, let the dealer do the 3rd one each time in case there have been any tsb's or software upgrade issues. I document all my work on a spreadsheet, keep receipts for oil and OEM filters and then scan them in in case I loose them. I keep a copy of that scan and my spreadsheet on my phone just in case. Toyota has an owners site as part of their corporate site where you can enter all the maintenance information you did and anything done at the dealer is entered automatically.

Of course, I haven't had a warranty claim in the last thirty years and don't anticipate one anytime in the future.

 

Yeah, that is because you have the V6. If you were driving around that pile of a 2.0 turbo you may anticipate a warranty claim! :laugh:

 

Ok Jimmy, think what you want but I am not making this up. It isn't an isolated incident.... I posted one link where someone got hosed and there are many others out there that can be found with a quick Google.

You vast experience and perceptions have no bearing on reality with KIA warranty claims.

 

Brian,

I really can't understand your stubbornness on this because of something you read on the internet. I'm telling you as an ex warranty specialist working at both domestic and foreign OEMs, there is no basis (i.e., legal) for denying warranty claims on documented service (either conducted via an authorized dealer, independent, or owner). I'm not "thinking" this, I'm empirically stating this as a truth (just go and read your Kia Warranty book and stop using Google and stop believing everything you read on the inter-webs).

 

We are just going to have to agree to disagree.

People are not making up all of these stories because they have nothing better to do. KIA has a reputation for being sticklers on warranty claims. I am not arguing that more often than not IF one properly documents their maintenance that they will be OK. What I am saying is that there have been instances with KIA has made folks lives VERY difficult and they have had claims denied or had to get a lawyer (while in some cases their can sits there for weeks or months) to straighten things out.

Another example that I saw was a car that had sludge buildup in the engine and they tried to file a claim. They had documentations showing they had oil changes completed by an independent shop but it looked pretty clear they were not actually changing the oil! Long story short, KIA did not pay for the engine replacement. These things happen. They are documented. Yes, I don't believe everything I see on the internet but I also don't believe corporations will always have their customers best interests in mind all of the time. Not serving your car at a KIA dealership while in warranty is rolling the dice as if you have an issue, they may make life very difficult for you. I prefer to stack the odds as much as possible in my favor as it makes me comfortable. If you feel comfortable doing what you are doing, good for you. Do what you want, it doesn't make a difference to me but don't act like the things I am talking about don't happen... because they do.

 

I'm not arguing whether they happen or not; again, I'm saying Kia cannot NOT honor a warranty claim because an owner decides to document and perform his or her own maintenance. You are not "stacking the odds as much as possible in your favor" via getting an oil and filter change at your local dealership versus an independent, for example. If your car engine suddenly blows up after 20K miles and your independent did two oil and filter changes for you (and it's documented) and your computer didn't throw or store any other codes since the vehicle was produced, Kia has to honor your warranty. Now, if some regional rep or manager at he corporate level wants to be a pain in the ass and "research" the issue and go back and forth and simply not issue an engine replacement under warranty then that may happen (in any possible world) but they will (and have to) eventually replace the engine under warranty (and whether you got the first two oil and filter changes at your dealership has nothing to do with what is motivating the behavior of that regional rep or employee).

There is a huge misnomer among car owners that service needs to be performed at authorized dealerships and it's just not true (whether it be on the service quality side or warranty side). The best way to go for some consumers is to find a good independent and stick with him or her (especially if the customer plans on keeping his or her vehicle for the long term).

 

Yes, I don't know the laws in Canada; my knowledge and expertise on warranty writing and claims are specific to the US market (though often the language is the same in the US and Canada, at least at that the two OEMs I worked at)

 

I'm saying Kia cannot NOT honor a warranty claim because an owner decides to document and perform his or her own maintenance. You are not "stacking the odds as much as possible in your favor" via getting an oil and filter change at your local dealership versus an independent, for example. If your car engine suddenly blows up after 20K miles and your independent did two oil and filter changes for you (and it's documented) and your computer didn't throw or store any other codes since the vehicle was produced, Kia has to honor your warranty.

No, you wrong. Actually, the can not honor a warranty claim or at minimum make you jump through all kinds of hoops (which could take weeks or months to sort out) and there are documented instances where this has happened. And yes, you are stacking the odds in your favor as if something goes wrong and a KIA dealer did all of the services as it would be 100% on KIA.

If you use an independent per your example, KIA could simply say they don't believe the independent changed the oil properly (the sludge example I gave) and where does that leave the customer? You would be in a world of hurt trying to get things straighten out! Don't try to make things so black and white, because they are not always that way. There is an added level of protection to the consumer by having KIA do the important services. There are so many dynamics and possible scenarios that can happen making things very difficult for customer related to warranty claims.

 

What in the world are you talking about? I'm not sure how many times or different ways I can make this factual claim to you, but here goes: if all scheduled maintenance as described in your owner's manual is performed and documented, either by an authorized dealer, independent mechanic, or owner Kia cannot obstruct a warranty claim (they can try) but there is no legal basis. There is no "stacking the odds" by going to a Kia Dealer versus an independent on scheduled maintenance if an issue surfaces.

Kia cannot state that an oil change was not completed properly by an independent, just like Kia cannot state that an oil change was not completed properly by a certified dealer (both document the oil change and update service records).

There is no "world of hurt" or "added protection" if you have scheduled maintenance done at a dealer. I've written more warranty manuals and handled more challenges of warranty claims then you have had morning cups of coffee. You are out of your league and talking nonsense and unwilling to listen to an expert.

 

Magnuson–Moss Warranty Act

 

Yes, in the US we are protected by that act, which not only allows us to do our own services, use an independent service shop, and even use non-OEM parts, ........ but when a warranty claim is made and service history is questioned, the vehicle owner needs to provide evidence of the service history.

We've had a few on the forum that found it absurd that Kia didn't tell them upfront to keep evidence of the service history, but thankfully those foolish ones are in the minority.

I buy my service parts and materials in bulk when on special and keep all receipts, record all work on an Excel spreadsheet, iPhone photos of my mileage showing the oil life, and log it with CarFax.

 

This is an oil change done on a 2019 Sedona, but the engine the same. Removal of undercarriage shroud isn't shown, but not sure if Sedona has one.

 

Thanks for finding this, it's a good video. I'm going to check manual, but does the MY19 V6 take 6.78 quarts of oil? Also, i'm going to run the same spec of oil indicated in the video (and again will check rec from manual) - what is everyone else running?

Mrs.O's Kia Sedona - Break In Oil Change - YouTube

This is an oil change done on a 2019 Sedona, but the engine the same. Removal of undercarriage shroud isn't shown, but not sure if Sedona has one.

 

Just thought I would add a few pics from my first change today at 1,155 miles shooting for every 5k using OE filter and Mobil 1 5W30. OE filter came with new rubber O-ring for filter cap and new aluminum crush washer for drain plug. 2 posts due to pic size limits!

17 - 10mm bolts for belly pan
17mm - drain plug
I used 1 1/16" socket for filter holder cap thingy fit perfect!

 

It's actually 27mm for the filter cover. 1 1/16" should work. It's only a few thousandths of an inch smaller. For the other person who asked, the kia filter part number is visible on the box in one of the pictures posted. When I did mine, I actually used a Wix filter that I got from Napa. Part number: FIL 100033. It's available for about half that price online at Rockauto.com.

Cheers!

 

Just thought I would add a few pics from my first change today at 1,155 miles shooting for every 5k using OE filter and Mobil 1 5W30. OE filter came with new rubber O-ring for filter cap and new aluminum crush washer for drain plug. 2 posts due to pic size limits!

17 - 10mm bolts for belly pan
17mm - drain plug
I used 1 1/16" socket for filter holder cap thingy fit perfect!

 

great post thanks! can you give me the model number of the oil filter? I ordered a MahleOX 355 26320 3CKB0 and it's correct on box, but on the filter itself is says MahleOX 355 26330 3CKB0,

 

Dipsticks are not exactly precise measuring tools so volume may vary.

 

So do mine they have 330 on the filter media.

 

Just did my first oil change and could only get this 6.6 quarts in. At 6.5, left for 10 min, check dipstick and it was halfway up. Added another 100ml, checked after 10 min and it was at full. 2019 SX

 

Did you check again after running the engine? The filter housing will store some amount.

 

Are the fasteners for the shroud plastic or metal? Are they all the same size and head?

 

They're all metal 10mm bolts.

Cheers!

 

They are all the same size and easy to get to. An impact driver is massive overkill. I use a tiny battery operated drill with socket adapter on it.

 

Just wanted to clarify that the recommendation to get an impact wrench is a general one for someone looking to work on their car. For the undercover, a regular drill works ok, and you certainly don't need the nut-busting power of an impact wrench. But with respect to regular maintenance on cars, there aren't many situations where a drill would be needed.. but there are many situations where an impact wrench makes the job much easier and faster (and, in some cases, it simply makes the job possible to do at home).

 

it would appear some of y'all need to rely on the Dealership or a Shop to change your oil.

worrying about 6.85 vs 6.90 quarts of oil is a bit much. You can be easily 1+ entire quarts low and the engine itself will be fine. 0.05 quarts isn't going to make a difference. Just put approximately 6.5 quarts in the engine. Then check the dipstick. Add as required until level is good.

keep track and ensure you don't overfill the engine. depending on how you install the oil filter, how long you let the engine drain, what temperature the oil was at draining, what ambient temp is, how sludged up your engine is: you may end up adding 7.5 quarts, or only 6 quarts.


also, pre-fill the filter as much as possible before installing. I haven't changed this one yet. Hopefully it is oriented vertical. I typically put almost 0.5 quarts into a filter before installing. That way there isn't any momentary lube lapses as then engine fills an empty filter during startup.


luckily this engine is smaller in capacity. My Suburban takes 9 quarts and only synthetic. Oil changes are rather expensive lol