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Discussion Starter #1
Over the long motoring years I have not bothered to check new air filters, fuel filters, oil filters, oil changes have been carried out when my car has been serviced. Perhaps now, as my mileage per year drops steadily and any mechanic can see five thousand miles is now my average and he can do the numbers, that I should start taking more notice. I am thinking more of the fuel filter than anything else. I can well imagine reading my small usage some mechanic not bothering changing this filter. On my Pro Ceed 3 I know it’s a bit of a swine to do, being situated against the bulkhead and needing other car parts removed simply to get at the thing. Having driven for more years than most and never even finding a fuel filter on my past cars I would have to sympathise with him missing out on this part of the job.
I wonder if there is a different servicing routine for mileages of my sort? It does sound reasonable and even more so, economically viable. That is, from the service stations point of view. I cannot possibly imagine a reduced service charge!:D
 

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Cerato S Hatch Auto
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After the initial warranty period, I put my cars on "Reduced Maintenance". That is, I get the oil/oil filter changed every 10,000km plus any other item that absolutely requires attention. For example, last service on my Mazda 6 included radiator flush and new coolant. Previous service required new rear brake pads.

I've found that the more modern cars don't need the degree of servicing that was traditionally recommended. We sold our 14 year old Ford Festiva recently, and it had been on the "reduced" schedule for more than 10 years. Sometimes it was up to 3 years between 10,000km servicing with no adverse effects. Obviously, I kept a close eye on the car, but probably saved up to $800 per year by avoiding scheduled services.

I should add that our cars are driven conservatively, that is moderate highway speeds and fairly long suburban commuting.
 

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Cars doing a low mileage still require all the specified items carrying out at the specified time interval, if you don't you will invalidate your warranty.

Cars doing a low mileage tend to do more short journeys from cold, these contaminate oil faster and short urban trips tend to require more brake usage as well.

Look at the maths, if you do 5000 miles a year at 40 mpg you will spend about £750 on fuel, your RFL will be £125 and insurance a minimum of £250, total cost £1,125 minimum. On top of that there is the depreciation you are suffering as well. What are you going to save by skimping on servicing, £100 a year if you miss certain checks, £250 a year if you miss a service entirely. Unless you go to a Kia dealer every year the body checks will not get carried out and your 5 year paint/12 year body warranties will lapse.

Is the small saving really worth it.
 

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Cerato S Hatch Auto
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It's a personal choice. You can get trapped into following the dealer recommendation, for example, some dealers offer "extended warranties" which require you to continue servicing at the original dealership. Some "time interval" servicing for low-mileage cars is obvious nonsense, for example changing spark plugs at "100,000km/5 years" when the car has only travelled 50,000km in 5 years. I'm also not convinced that Paint/Body warranties are worth anything.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Cars doing a low mileage still require all the specified items carrying out at the specified time interval, if you don't you will invalidate your warranty.

Cars doing a low mileage tend to do more short journeys from cold, these contaminate oil faster and short urban trips tend to require more brake usage as well.

Look at the maths, if you do 5000 miles a year at 40 mpg you will spend about £750 on fuel, your RFL will be £125 and insurance a minimum of £250, total cost £1,125 minimum. On top of that there is the depreciation you are suffering as well. What are you going to save by skimping on servicing, £100 a year if you miss certain checks, £250 a year if you miss a service entirely. Unless you go to a Kia dealer every year the body checks will not get carried out and your 5 year paint/12 year body warranties will lapse.



Sorry Skidlid,
I fear my posting cannot have been all that clear. I tried to ask if an actual car mechanic when working at my four year old Pro Cee’d looking at my low yearly mileage would possible ignore Kia’s “Must Do “servicing instructions and use his common sense. As Wry Cuda points out in his informative entry it does make sense to ignore changing spark plus after only ten thousand miles. I would presume the Kia guarantee, generous as it is, took into account all the options and chose methods to service their cars thinking of more like twenty thousand miles per year.
My thoughts are possible clouded by my passed sixty years of motoring and always using my one year guarantee, then servicing my cars myself to save garage costs. In those days money was tight so I changed my oil more regularly to keep the engine and gearbox in good heart, changed the filters more often, watched what I knew to be important, such as steering and braking and kept my cars for an average of nine to ten years.
I think my last sentence explained I fully realised in no way would Kia ever make allowances for my low yearly mileage. I was quite happy to pay the full costs and help balance their books.
Immediately after my first Mot examination full pass at my Kia agency I troubled myself to examine my brake disks due to an assumed fall off in breaking efficiency. My brake disks were badly worn and corroded to the point where I would assume less than two thirds braking surface area was left. My mileage at this time was well under twenty thousand. I skimmed the disks back to a clean surface, changed the shoes and at my next service went to a garage I was sure I can trust. My idea with the Kia and its seven year warranty was, at eighty one years of age I would no longer have to get out and get under my car. It was a mistake that I acknowledge and I hope your agency practices what it preaches and you will be happy to remain with them. :D
 

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Mechanics can of course ignore Kia's recommendations. But should you require warranty work carrying out after that service and Kia refuse due to the incorrect maintenance being carried out would your mechanic do the work and any subsequent work not covered due to his shortcuts free of charge., of course not, you would be well and truly stuffed.

With regard to brakes no manufacturer covers them, like clutches they are a wearitem. No idea what you were doing to wear them so badly, after 25,000 ours are like new. Why you would think that Kia would replace wear parts for 7 years is beyond me, it is stated quite clearly in the warranty documents and on-line on the Kia website under warranty terms.

I know its personal choice but for the extra £100 approx a year it costs me to have the car serviced by a Kia dealer (less when you take body inspection costs off) I think its a bargain to keep the warranty going.
 

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You need to consider the remaining value of the car when deciding how much to spend on maintenance. Perhaps we were lucky with our 14-year old Ford, but once it depreciated to 50% of new value (down to $7000 approx.), I decided that it was "just transport".

10 years of "minimal maintenance" kept it in good running condition with no major expenses. We also decided not to comprehensively insure the car once it depreciated a little further. I calculate that we saved at least $7500 over 10 years by not doing things exactly "by the book", and bearing the risk of crash repairs.

Many of the items on recommended maintenance schedules are simply "flick and tick", and you have to wonder whether some are checked at all.

The adage "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" tends to apply to car maintenance issues. I have a vivid recollection of wrecking the thread of a valve rocker while trying to adjust out the slight valve noise on my fairly new car. It is possible to over-maintain a car.
 

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Wry 'Cuda

You are comparing a 14 year old Ford with no warranty and a hard life behind it with new(ish) Kia's with a 7 year warranty, that is not a fair comparison. If I had an ancient car I would not spend money on dealer maintenance but with a newish one under warranty its a different matter.
 

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All I'm trying to say is that it's an option to ignore the recommended schedule at your own risk. I use the example of the old Ford to demonstrate that you don't have to do it by the book and it's OK even if you intend keeping the car for an extended period. It's likely that johnfranklyn could drive his Pro Ceed for another 5 years without doing any servicing apart from an oil change.

Our KIA Cerato is still under warranty (5 years) and I'm happy with the 12-month/15,000km service intervals since this matches our current usage.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Mechanics can of course ignore Kia's recommendations. But should you require warranty work carrying out after that service and Kia refuse due to the incorrect maintenance being carried out would your mechanic do the work and any subsequent work not covered due to his shortcuts free of charge., of course not, you would be well and truly stuffed.

With regard to brakes no manufacturer covers them, like clutches they are a wearitem. No idea what you were doing to wear them so badly, after 25,000 ours are like new. Why you would think that Kia would replace wear parts for 7 years is beyond me, it is stated quite clearly in the warranty documents and on-line on the Kia website under warranty terms.

I know its personal choice but for the extra £100 approx a year it costs me to have the car serviced by a Kia dealer (less when you take body inspection costs off) I think its a bargain to keep the warranty going.
Skidlid
1. After the kia agency missed the wear on my disks, which by the way despite you deciding I wanted the work done for free, I would have been happy to pay for replacements. Perhaps you can you point out where I stated I wanted free disk replacements please?

2. My Kia agency is more than one hundred miles away from my home. The next one is at Perth, more than two hundred miles away. After finding the Kia agency had passed my badly warn brakes I came to the conclusion it was not safe for me to remain with them and took my motor for its future MOT’s and servicing to a Bosch garage I had used before. By the way, the Key agency said they would honour my guarantee as long as replacement parts came from Kia. I suspect with the new EEC regulations this would not be entirely enforceable.

3. I am never the less happy to now ignore my Kia guarantee, its worth less than I value my family’s safety. Strangely enough a friend who purchased a Kia Ceed on my recommendation just after I purchased mine had to return his car after his MOT with the same problems as myself. They sent him away whilst they got the brake parts advising him to drive very slowly and to keep his distance from traffic. His brakes were so noisy he hired a replacement car. I have to wonder if his disks came out of the same furnace load.

4. When I faced up my worn disks on my lathe I was aware I was turning the dirtiest cast iron I had ever machined. With only small cuts I ended up covered in carbon dust. I assume from your forum entry you are also are a qualified engineer, so you must be aware cast iron varies in quality. My faced up disks continued to wear far too fast and I subsequently had to purchase new ones. They are now, I am pleased to write, showing normal wear.

5. I wish you joy with your Kia and all its future servicing. May your brakes continue to wear well and your Kia guarantee work to your advantage? I am happy to admit my personal view of my Kia is it’s a super little motor, well worth the money. My opinion of the local Kia agency’s mechanics is another matter.

6. Please read these entries carefully, as I don’t intend to waste my time explaining again.
 

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John

I cannot see the point in your original post, you have clearly made your mind up about your "local" Kia dealer.

Personally I would never buy a car where the nearest dealer was over 100 miles away, totally crazy.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Personally I would like to buy a car from a dealer nearer to me. I live on the WEST COASTof Scotland. Inverness is my nearest point of call to buy a new car, that is situated on the EAST COAST. Yes, I am totally crazy, I could always walk to do some shopping in Inverness. Its only 100 miles. Can you understand the geography. If not, buy a map.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Dearest Skidlid,
Personally I would like to buy a car from a dealer nearer to me. I live on the WEST COASTof Scotland. Inverness is my nearest point of call to buy a new car, that is situated on the EAST COAST. Yes, I am totally crazy, I could always walk to do some shopping in Inverness. Its only 100 miles. Can you understand the geography. If not, buy a map.
 

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Dearest Skidlid,
Personally I would like to buy a car from a dealer nearer to me. I live on the WEST COASTof Scotland. Inverness is my nearest point of call to buy a new car, that is situated on the EAST COAST. Yes, I am totally crazy, I could always walk to do some shopping in Inverness. Its only 100 miles. Can you understand the geography. If not, buy a map.
Gosh, I have moved up in the world, I am "Dearest" now, should I be worried?

My geography is fine, got an A level. I know exactly where Inverness and Perth are in relation to the west coast, was up there 3 weeks ago.

What amazes me totally is you buy a car form a dealer who is 100 miles away and complain how far away they are, did you not notice when you bought it.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Gosh, I have moved up in the world, I am "Dearest" now, should I be worried?

My geography is fine, got an A level. I know exactly where Inverness and Perth are in relation to the west coast, was up there 3 weeks ago.

What amazes me totally is you buy a car form a dealer who is 100 miles away and complain how far away they are, did you not notice when you bought it.
The Dearest Skidlid title you have certainly earned. :)You have acted a bit of a dear in the way you quote your own opinions and feelings and quibble at anyone who happens to think differently.

The distance came with buying the car. ITS WHERE EVERYONE HAS TO GO TO BUY A NEW CAR UP HERE.! Is this just too hard for you to understand? The guarantee did look a good thing, the servicing turned out to be not worth driving two hundred miles just to get a poor job done. It’s hardly rocket science. My new service garage is a mere forty six miles away, so much closer.

Congratulations on the Geography A level by the way. It must have been a bit of a surprise. Anyone who thinks the Highlands West Coast is a place to buy a new car should have failed.:D Now if I wanted to buy fish.
 

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Quite amusing thread. I found that I had to read the OP (Original Post) several times to see if I was missing something that Skidlid objected to, but No.

I've travelled in Scotland, and even A-students might not realise how sparcely settled it is. The severe winters might influence your servicing schedules, I imagine.

Is the car diesel? Hence particular interest in fuel filter?

Happy motoring.
 

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Immediately after my first Mot examination full pass at my Kia agency I troubled myself to examine my brake disks due to an assumed fall off in breaking efficiency. My brake disks were badly worn and corroded to the point where I would assume less than two thirds braking surface area was left.
What stuns me most about this post (John Franklin has mentioned it several times before) is the fact that he appears to be complaining that the Kia garage passed his car in the MOT test.

On some Kia services they do not inspect the brakes and in the MOT they do not inspect the pad and disc condition, its all about braking efficiency on the rollers or or using an old school Tapley meter on the road.

If you had a problem with the garage why did you not complain to the DVLA, if you think they did a shoddy job you should have raised it. No point raising the issue on a forum however long later.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Quite amusing thread. I found that I had to read the OP (Original Post) several times to see if I was missing something that Skidlid objected to, but No.

I've travelled in Scotland, and even A-students might not realise how sparcely settled it is. The severe winters might influence your servicing schedules, I imagine.

Is the car diesel? Hence particular interest in fuel filter?

Happy motoring.
Hello Wry ‘ Cuda,
It has been an amusing thread even if the original question was rather spun out. Thanks for your entries. Your explanation in answer to my original question was very helpful and suddenly I did not feel so isolated. Yes, its a diesel and I did wonder if changing my fuel filter was such a big deal in my case. It’s hard to get at, according to the Kia servicing manual. If ever you get back up in the highlands please look me up.
I do enjoy my motoring up here, very empty roads, apart from summer holiday makers with their happy squealing kids on the beach. Its wonderful to watch and listen to them, such a change from sheep.

Regards,
Johnfranklyn
 

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Discussion Starter #19
What stuns me most about this post (John Franklin has mentioned it several times before) is the fact that he appears to be complaining that the Kia garage passed his car in the MOT test.

On some Kia services they do not inspect the brakes and in the MOT they do not inspect the pad and disc condition, its all about braking efficiency on the rollers or or using an old school Tapley meter on the road.

If you had a problem with the garage why did you not complain to the DVLA, if you think they did a shoddy job you should have raised it. No point raising the issue on a forum however long later.
Sorry to offend you seven 7
My original forum entry was a rather simple question well answered by Wry ‘Cuda.
I have had little experience of garage servicing efficiency until I bought the Kia, having looked after my cars myself until then. The long warranty and my advancing nage changed my mind and I returned my car to Kia and simply went with the easiest option.
Yes, I have to admit, I found fault with my particular Kia agency. Sorry for that. Perhaps, as they were just setting it up from new and had been tacked onto another much larger agency with a superbly equipped service station the Kia equipment looked rather poor when I looked in. Please, that is only my opinion! In the four years I attended the Kia set up I also noted a constant change of service staff. That also may have affected my judgement. In simple terms, I did not feel safe driving my Kia with the brakes in the condition I found them in after my MOT test. Why did I not make a fuss? Perhaps I just could not be bothered. The garage I have my car serviced at now does not sell cars. Their reputation rests on their standard of their servicing work. It’s possibly as simple as that for me.
Please do not get me wrong. I like my Kia very much, Its well made, has a good performance and I have no doubt whatsoever most Kia owners will be delighted to have it serviced by their agency.
In my case, and this is only my personal opinion, I was not happy with my agency. If you are not happy to accept this I am sorry for your disappointment. There is not much I can possible do about it.
 

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Perhaps, as they were just setting it up from new and had been tacked onto another much larger agency with a superbly equipped service station the Kia equipment looked rather poor when I looked in.
This is a common problem especially with new franchises set up during scrapage. The existing Ford, Vauxhall, Renault etc. etc. businesses they were tagged onto have a poor reputation for customer service. When we bought our car one of our "local" Kia dealers was recently tagged onto a Ford dealership. When questioned they were totally ignoring the Kia service schedule and substituting the Ford one including Ford oil which is totally the wrong spec for a Ceed with a DPF. The number of Kia's they sell and service is tiny compared to their Ford business, all they were bothered about was the scrapage sales. Heard of one Renault/Kia dealership charging £100 for an aircon service at 2 years because that is what they do on Renaults.

Another "local" dealership had just taken on Kia to replace the Subaru franchise they had lost for undisclosed reasons, they did not have a clue.

The Kia dealer we bought from and use is a small independant family owned garage and is one of the longest established Kia franchises in the UK, Kia's are their only income, get it wrong and there is no fall back, they go out of business.
 
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