Kia Forum banner

1 - 21 of 29 Posts

·
Registered
2019 Kia Sedona
Joined
·
13 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hey guys, I'm new to the Kia forum so thanks for having me.

I'm having an issue with my wife's 2019 Sedona, usually on a vehicle this new I'd just bring it to the dealer and let them take care of it, but that's another problem I'm working on right now. Long story short is we got an unexpected posting to northern Canada and the nearest dealership is 800km away. I've been on VW and Chevy truck forums before and have done lots of my own work, but I'm struggling to find good info on this van.

We noticed this (very cold, like -40 cold) winter that the van won't heat up. Very little cabin heat and the coolant temp gauge barely moves. I'm still trying to work the warranty angle but it's not looking good so I'm going to start doing some diagnosing myself. Problem is we also live in a small town where you never go on the highway and mostly have short drives, but even with that my wife has asked around and everyone else with a minivan (so similar cabin and engine sizes) has been able to get there's to warm up. So short of taking it for a cruise down the highway to nowhere (its on my to do list) I'm wondering where to start this trouble shooting. I'm thinking maybe the thermostat is stuck open and so the coolant never gets a chance to properly heat up.

Anyone have any good info on where to start? Or where I could find some decent diagrams or technical info for this van? Anything helps and is appreciated.
 

·
Registered
2019 Kia Sportage. SX with AWD. 2.0L Direct Injected Turbocharged & Intercooled Gas.
Joined
·
632 Posts
Call a dealership and explain your predicament and ask to talk with their best tech. In the meantime put a piece of cardboard in front of the radiator to cut cooling capacity. Good luck!
 

·
Registered
2019 Kia Sedona
Joined
·
13 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
I put the cardboard in a couple weeks ago, covers about 2/3rds of the rad, couldn't do anymore just because of how the plastics are and how hard it was to get the cardboard stuffed in there. Didn't make a difference lol.

Finding a tech who's willing to give me some guidance is a good idea though, thanks.
 

·
Super Moderator
99 Kia Elan 1.8L, 17 Ford Edge Sport 2.7L V6, 15 Mustang 3.7L V6, 08 Harley Nightrain
Joined
·
10,620 Posts
I'm thinking maybe the thermostat is stuck open and so the coolant never gets a chance to properly heat up.
Your thinking would be correct.

Unfortunately it will take some time to address this with Kia, and if the dealership still claims that its normal for the engine to never reach operating temperature test that theory on one of the vehicles in their lot.

The bulk of the engine wear happens while its below normal operating temperature, so not something you should allow to drag out.
 

·
Registered
2019 Kia Sedona
Joined
·
13 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
Your thinking would be correct.

Unfortunately it will take some time to address this with Kia, and if the dealership still claims that its normal for the engine to never reach operating temperature test that theory on one of the vehicles in their lot.

The bulk of the engine wear happens while its below normal operating temperature, so not something you should allow to drag out.
Would you happen to know any specific info on this? Like what temp the engine should maintain? Or the temp of the thermostat?

I'm in contact with kia customer care and so far they're willing to tow the van to get it fixed, but I'd still be on the hook to pick it up, which is really not helpful lol. I'm hoping maybe if I can pin point the problem I can bug them enough to at least get them to cover to the cost of the part. I don't know, I'll probably end up just doing it and paying for it myself but it's frustrating to have to work on it when we bought new specifically so I wouldn't need to do this lol.
 

·
Registered
2019 Kia Sportage. SX with AWD. 2.0L Direct Injected Turbocharged & Intercooled Gas.
Joined
·
632 Posts
Any possible way to park inside a garage and leave a trouble light on with old fashioned incandescent 100W bulb under the hood?
 

·
Registered
2019 Kia Sedona
Joined
·
13 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
Any possible way to park inside a garage and leave a trouble light on with old fashioned incandescent 100W bulb under the hood?
Yea I can take it to the heated hangar at work to work on it, so it's been properly thawed and the whole thing heated up above freezing a couple times.

Using my Bluetooth OBD2 adapter I've watched the coolant temp and by holding it at about 2000 rpm for a bit to simulate faster driving I got it to about 62C, but as soon as I let off the gas it cooled down again to mid 50s. Even if it's -30 or so outside I wouldn't think it would cool down so quickly just at idle.
 

·
Registered
2019 Kia Sedona
Joined
·
13 Posts
Discussion Starter #7
Also I forgot to mention, I don't know if it's related or not but twice now she's had the CEL come on for:
"P2118 - Powertrain - Throttle Actuator Control Motor Current Range/ PENDING Performance"
It happened both times when it was really cold (-40) and she forgot to plug it in at work, started it and then drove it right away without letting it warm up at all. So she's learned that even with the block heater she needs to let it idle when it's cold out.

I phoned the dealership and the tech said that it was just due to it being so cold and no warm up time. Same with the back hatch latch not latching below -35C, this van hates the cold lol.
 

·
Registered
2011 Forte SX 2.4L (thankfully MPI) A/T 144K miles
Joined
·
1,318 Posts
…. I phoned the dealership and the tech said that it was just due to it being so cold and no warm up time. Same with the back hatch latch not latching below -35C, this van hates the cold lol.
Can you just take it for an extended ride (1/2 hour or so), and monitor how long it actually takes to warm-up in those low temps? Operating temp should ultimately probably be somewhere around 88C, and it should eventually get there regardless of the cold, as all of the metal in the engine bay finally gets heated up.
 

·
Registered
2019 Kia Sedona
Joined
·
13 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
Can you just take it for an extended ride (1/2 hour or so), and monitor how long it actually takes to warm-up in those low temps? Operating temp should ultimately probably be somewhere around 88C, and it should eventually get there regardless of the cold, as all of the metal in the engine bay finally gets heated up.

Ok 88C awesome thanks. I'm actually on vacation in Florida right now and trying to gather all the info I need to sort it out when I get home. Taking it for a cruise down the highway is at the top of my list, but knowing the numbers like that to look for is what I need.

I've been looking up general info on how to troubleshoot this problem but do you have any more kia/engine specific info like that that would help?
 

·
Registered
2019 Kia Sedona
Joined
·
13 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
Ok so I found some good info on this site, found the link in another thread on this forum.


It says opening should be 88±2C, full open at 100C.
But it also says: "Immerse thermostat in water heated to over 95°C (203°F), then heat for at least 3 minutes to check valve lift."
And also: "Notice: Do not use water below 95°C".
So how am I supposed to determine that it opened correctly at 88 if I can't use water below 95?
 

·
Super Moderator
99 Kia Elan 1.8L, 17 Ford Edge Sport 2.7L V6, 15 Mustang 3.7L V6, 08 Harley Nightrain
Joined
·
10,620 Posts
First check once you have removed the thermostat is to confirm is position at ambient, and with the symptoms its most likely wide open and no further testing required.

If its closed then lower it into water that's at boiling or close to it and if it does not open its bad, and that failure would cause overheating.
 

·
Registered
2011 Forte SX 2.4L (thankfully MPI) A/T 144K miles
Joined
·
1,318 Posts
IMO, based on what you've written, there's no reason at this point to assume the thermostat is having a problem. There is a 'flywheel' temperature effect going on, and will continue until something changes. All of the metal in your vehicle has a core temp of -40, and does not ever get a chance to heat up (based on what you said about only taking short trips). So the engine and cooling system components are surrounded by ice packs that never get a chance to thaw out.

A more typical and normal driving pattern, with fairly regular trips of at least 1/2 hour, would raise the core temp of all the metal in the vehicle, and even sitting unused overnight is not enough for the -40 to fully sink all the way back in. So the next time one of these vehicles starts up, it doesn't have to overcome the extremely cold flywheel that yours does.

I suggest giving it a chance to warm up a few times for at least 1 hour, before taking any other action. However, I also suspect that with warmer temps being almost certainly just around the corner, this is going to become far less of an issue for you in the near future.
 

·
Registered
2019 Kia Sportage. SX with AWD. 2.0L Direct Injected Turbocharged & Intercooled Gas.
Joined
·
632 Posts
Ok so I found some good info on this site, found the link in another thread on this forum.


It says opening should be 88±2C, full open at 100C.
But it also says: "Immerse thermostat in water heated to over 95°C (203°F), then heat for at least 3 minutes to check valve lift."
And also: "Notice: Do not use water below 95°C".
So how am I supposed to determine that it opened correctly at 88 if I can't use water below 95?
Something got lost in the translation. Use common sense and you will get there......
 

·
Registered
2019 Kia Sportage. SX with AWD. 2.0L Direct Injected Turbocharged & Intercooled Gas.
Joined
·
632 Posts
IMO, based on what you've written, there's no reason at this point to assume the thermostat is having a problem. There is a 'flywheel' temperature effect going on, and will continue until something changes. All of the metal in your vehicle has a core temp of -40, and does not ever get a chance to heat up (based on what you said about only taking short trips). So the engine and cooling system components are surrounded by ice packs that never get a chance to thaw out.

A more typical and normal driving pattern, with fairly regular trips of at least 1/2 hour, would raise the core temp of all the metal in the vehicle, and even sitting unused overnight is not enough for the -40 to fully sink all the way back in. So the next time one of these vehicles starts up, it doesn't have to overcome the extremely cold flywheel that yours does.

I suggest giving it a chance to warm up a few times for at least 1 hour, before taking any other action. However, I also suspect that with warmer temps being almost certainly just around the corner, this is going to become far less of an issue for you in the near future.
Even more reason to seek out a garage to park in. Purchase a 'oil dip stick' electric oil warmer to help keep the block and oil warm. That should help quite a bit!
 

·
Registered
2011 Forte SX 2.4L (thankfully MPI) A/T 144K miles
Joined
·
1,318 Posts
.. Purchase a 'oil dip stick' electric oil warmer to help keep the block and oil warm. That should help quite a bit!
The OP indicated a block heater is in use, but that's not going to have a significant warming effect on any of the metal (including the transmission) which surrounds the engine.
 

·
Super Moderator
99 Kia Elan 1.8L, 17 Ford Edge Sport 2.7L V6, 15 Mustang 3.7L V6, 08 Harley Nightrain
Joined
·
10,620 Posts
IMO, based on what you've written, there's no reason at this point to assume the thermostat is having a problem. There is a 'flywheel' temperature effect going on, and will continue until something changes. All of the metal in your vehicle has a core temp of -40, and does not ever get a chance to heat up (based on what you said about only taking short trips). So the engine and cooling system components are surrounded by ice packs that never get a chance to thaw out.

A more typical and normal driving pattern, with fairly regular trips of at least 1/2 hour, would raise the core temp of all the metal in the vehicle, and even sitting unused overnight is not enough for the -40 to fully sink all the way back in. So the next time one of these vehicles starts up, it doesn't have to overcome the extremely cold flywheel that yours does.

I suggest giving it a chance to warm up a few times for at least 1 hour, before taking any other action. However, I also suspect that with warmer temps being almost certainly just around the corner, this is going to become far less of an issue for you in the near future.
What I got from what was written is that although it's mainly short trips, other vehicles in the area are warming up, so the key here is for the OP to confirm the duration of the "short" trips, and a test drive of a dealerships vehicle would also confirm what should be expected.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
69 Posts
I notice mine takes a while to warm up even if it does. Driving to my work 10km away isnt enough to raise the Temp needle enough to my taste If i drive casually... (the road towards my job can be done with only 1stop 2 red lights, 100m at 10mph, one acceleration to 50mph, and two to 30mph, and the trip is at most 15 minutes.

It does get to temps but needs about at least 15-20min if driving at a stable 1500rpm if its very cold, like minus 20 celsius and under.
It can get to temps alot faster if I step on the gas and go over 70mph instead of grannying my way over there at 40-45
 

·
Registered
2019 Kia Sedona
Joined
·
13 Posts
Discussion Starter #20
Sorry looks like my post from before didn't upload.

Thanks for all the responses, I'll try to address everything at once here.

I do understand its tough for the engine to overcome a cold soaked engine bay, but as someone else said afterwards, my wife has talked to other people with different vans and theirs do eventually warm up. My trucks (granted they have 5.3L and 5.7L engines) warm up no problem even at -40. The van usually does short trips, but even the longer runs around town it doesn't warm up. What I plan on doing when I get home is just going for a 1 hour cruise down the highway and see what happens. I'll also bring it in the hangar for a couple hours to heat up the whole thing (this has been done a couple times but to work on other stuff, I wasn't paying attention to the coolant temp then). I do have a block heater that runs every morning too, you can tell it helps with the start with how it sounds but that's about it.

I'm not going to just replace the thermostat without confirming it, so like I said I'll go for a drive and put it in the hangar. I have a laser thermometer that I'll use and see what's going on with the coolant lines. If that indicates an open thermostat then I'll remove it and test in water like I found in the link above.

Also, no one has suggested anything else that could be wrong, which is part of why I asked here, to see if there was something I hadn't thought of.

I really appreciate all the input here guys, very helpful. At this point I have a decent game plan for when I get home on the weekend. Once I get through it I'll post my findings and hopefully it will be a bad thermostat since that's an easy and cheap fix to do myself since warranty seems like it's not an option. Any other ideas or considerations in the mean time are always welcome.
 
1 - 21 of 29 Posts
Top