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2017 Kia Sportage EX
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Discussion Starter #1
While awaiting my wife shopping, I will sit in my car reading the paper as I listen to the radio. While doing so, I get the following message as well as a beeping tone on the radio: "Battery discharge warning. Please use the system with engine running". The message appears about every five minutes. A real pain in the ass. I never had such a message in any of my many vehicles before. Is this a Kia thing?
 

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2017 Kia Sportage SX Turbo
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Just a Kia thing, wish I knew how to turn it off though.
 

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Any car with a 320 watt audio amp and sub probably uses more power than normal. Therefore, the warning is justified. Would you rather sit there with a dead battery? On the other hand, one warning is probably enough. If you disregard time after than you probably will get what you deserve. My guess is that it would take an hour or so to wear down the battery, but to be honest, I don't know exactly how long -- and I'm not willing to test it for you....
 
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2016 Sorento SX V6 , 2012 Soul !
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Not sure how much power it uses but it is definitely more than just a standard radio. Not only are you powering the head unit with a large screen, you are powering an amplifier, SiriusXM receiver and a GPS receiver.

Someone probably was stuck in the middle of nowhere with a dead battery and tried to sue so the message was the solution...
 

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2017 Kia Sportage SX
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Agreed also would love to have a cigarette lighter plug that works with the engine off. So I could charge a mobile when the motor is off like I've done for years in other vehicles. Will get that fixed when I bring it in to install my sub

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2017 AWD Sportage SX - Black / Beige
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Any car with a 320 watt audio amp and sub probably uses more power than normal. Therefore, the warning is justified. Would you rather sit there with a dead battery? On the other hand, one warning is probably enough. If you disregard time after than you probably will get what you deserve. My guess is that it would take an hour or so to wear down the battery, but to be honest, I don't know exactly how long -- and I'm not willing to test it for you....
well lets play with some numbers.

320 watts of audio output. Can we assume the amp is 50% efficient? If so input power would be ~640Watts...to produce the 320 watt audio output.

Now, 640 watts from a 12DC system would require something like 53 amps. However, fortunately, the system will never continuously produce 320 watts of audio output. audio output power is generally unstable, higher the volume, the more power required. As the music plays for example, when the bass spikes, power spikes as well. When the level is quiet for that violin solo, power would tend to be low, or lower. And we assumed 50% efficiency. If it's not that good, then input power requirements go up.

So its an averaging game. However, if you're into continuous hi volume levels with some of that head bangin stuff you will be drawing some serious juice from the battery for sure.

From an engineering standpoint it makes me think the warning is justified as much as it's a pita.
 

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2017 AWD Sportage SX Black Cherry/Beige
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So I could charge a mobile when the motor is off like I've done for years in other vehicles. Sent from my SM-G935W8 using Tapatalk
Well the USB port between those two 12V plugs is hot all the time. I have from time to time used it charge my iPhone with the engine off. Not sure how how strong the charging rate is but it does work if using for a cell phone.
 

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2020 Kia Sportage SX AWD and 1988 Mercedes 300CE
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Agreed also would love to have a cigarette lighter plug that works with the engine off. So I could charge a mobile when the motor is off like I've done for years in other vehicles. Will get that fixed when I bring it in to install my sub

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The power outlets (cigarette lighter plug) will work without the motor running if you press the Start button without putting your foot on the brake pedal (initiates the "Acc" position). Pressing once more (without using the brake) will cycle the system to the "On" position. And pressing it again returns to the "Off" position.
 
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2017 Kia Sportage SX
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well lets play with some numbers.

320 watts of audio output. Can we assume the amp is 50% efficient? If so input power would be ~640Watts...to produce the 320 watt audio output.

Now, 640 watts from a 12DC system would require something like 53 amps. However, fortunately, the system will never continuously produce 320 watts of audio output. audio output power is generally unstable, higher the volume, the more power required. As the music plays for example, when the bass spikes, power spikes as well. When the level is quiet for that violin solo, power would tend to be low, or lower. And we assumed 50% efficiency. If it's not that good, then input power requirements go up.

So its an averaging game. However, if you're into continuous hi volume levels with some of that head bangin stuff you will be drawing some serious juice from the battery for sure.

From an engineering standpoint it makes me think the warning is justified as much as it's a pita.
320 W peak, not RMS so perhaps you should cut 320 in 2 giving 160 W

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Well the USB port between those two 12V plugs is hot all the time. I have from time to time used it charge my iPhone with the engine off. Not sure how how strong the charging rate is but it does work if using for a cell phone.
Good to know better than nothing

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The power outlets (cigarette lighter plug) will work without the motor running if you press the Start button without putting your foot on the brake pedal (initiates the "Acc" position). Pressing once more (without using the brake) will cycle the system to the "On" position. And pressing it again returns to the "Off" position.
Yes but I'm looking to also charge when I'm out of the vehicle

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2020 Kia Sportage SX AWD and 1988 Mercedes 300CE
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2016 Rio SX
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I have two AVN heads on a bench for some testing but running from an external power supply, one is from a 2012 Rio the other a 2016 Rio and I get that battery warning intermittently on both. Now my conclusion is that there is a voltage monitor circuit internal to the head that is used to monitor the battery (applied) voltage, clearly from my test setups it seems that even with no other load except the head itself (no audio, no speakers connected etc) then my units display the error. I have played with the applied voltage running form 11.5V (low battery) to around 14.6V (high - a running car) - in both cases this warning still intermittently appears with no correlation to the actual head voltage. Personally I would not worry too much unless your reading war and peace in the car with the volume up to full for the whole day :) This is just observational, I believe there might be an error in the way the voltage is measured or some up to now unseen (by me) voltage drop inside the unit causing false readings.
 

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2016 Sorento SX V6 , 2012 Soul !
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I doubt the head unit is measuring any voltage. It is most likely just programmed to display that warning when the car isn't running.
 

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2016 Rio SX
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Actually its extremely likely that it is reading internal voltage, we are talking about a device that is running Windows CE with a reasonably powerful processor (including analogue inputs) with I think it was at least four internal sub regulators and a backup power (super cap to some people) supply. Its only real power inputs are power (direct..ish from battery) and switched power (when key is in 'running' or button pressed to start) but not specifically a running status indication. I can also use my bench setup to simulate 'running' and 'non-running' conditions - the warning appears on both again regardless of voltage within reason. For you numbers fans earlier the head itself without the audio connected to speakers (i.e just display running with say GPS maps displayed) takes 1.2A at voltages of between 12V and 14.4V - only a slight variation on current with voltage as expected probably due to internal regulation etc and no speakers of course.
 

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Actually its extremely likely that it is reading internal voltage, we are talking about a device that is running Windows CE with a reasonably powerful processor (including analogue inputs) with I think it was at least four internal sub regulators and a backup power (super cap to some people) supply. Its only real power inputs are power (direct..ish from battery) and switched power (when key is in 'running' or button pressed to start) but not specifically a running status indication. I can also use my bench setup to simulate 'running' and 'non-running' conditions - the warning appears on both again regardless of voltage within reason. For you numbers fans earlier the head itself without the audio connected to speakers (i.e just display running with say GPS maps displayed) takes 1.2A at voltages of between 12V and 14.4V - only a slight variation on current with voltage as expected probably due to internal regulation etc and no speakers of course.
The head unit communicates with other devices in the car over the CAN bus. It can definitely know if the car is running or not. You even stated you simulated a running voltage of 14.6V and the warning still appeared. The warning never appears when the car is running. Also, the gen 4 AVN units and the unit used in the K900 all run Android.
 

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2016 Rio SX
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Correct the unit could detect if the car was 'running' using the CAN bus, although the RIO AVN 2012 head does not have the CAN connected internally, components maybe fitted at a later date maybe as there are the footprints for them, the 2016 does of course have the CAN connected although this is the BODY CAN bus not the OBD or Power chain CAN bus - there is a bridge between both of them. I don't know what the gen 4 or K900 units are but I know definitely know that the Rio 2012 and Rio 2016 heads use Windows CE, besides being familiar with the software there is a nice sticker on the top indicating that - it would be interesting if KIA are using two different operating systems on their models though.
 
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