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2009 Kia Borrego
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Discussion Starter #21
Update: 17 MAR 2011

In late December 2010, our family had to take a road trip to IL due to a death in the family. On the way there, we once again experienced a life threatening situtation due to our '09 Kia Borrego.

We were driving on I-80 East, somewhere in Iowa. I was driving in the right lane and approaching a semi that was going slower than I was. Needing to pass the vehicle, I 'jumped' on the gas and got into the left lane. There were a couple of cars and another semi behind me (not too close, at this time). When I hit the gas to accelerate past the semi, the engine exhibited the stalling/quitting issue that had occurred so many times before. But this time, it almost immediately stopped! Instantly, I had two cars and a semi on my tail--as the Kia had completely shut off. I had NO power. In order to avert a major accident (and possibly death to my whole family), I had to swerve off the highway and onto the left shoulder. The truck that I had been trying to pass was BESIDE me, so I couldn't go into the right lane. Instead, I had to utilize the left shoulder, which was only about 3 feet wide. There was quite a steep dropoff to the left of the shoulder, but I managed to get the Kia completely off the highway and avoid an accident.

The next day, we attended the funeral and I called Kia for an appointment for the vehicle to be serviced. I made arrangements for the vehicle to be dropped off at the same dealership where we had purchased the vehicle in 2009 (Bill Jacobs Kia, Joliet, IL).

Long story short, they found no issues with the engine, and since there was no engine light or codes to be found, they fixed nothing. They actually attempted absolutely nothing.

Ever since that time, in other words, since December of 2010, I can now reproduce the engine stalling issue whenever I want!!! It happens every time I go to pass a vehicle. It happens whenever I jump on it to accelerate to highway speeds. It happens whenever I try to get on a highway. In fact, whenever I push the pedal, let's say, over 50% or 60% down, the engine WILL STALL OUT! In fact, it feels as if someone is standing on the brakes, even though the brake pedal is not being pushed down!

So once again, I made arrangements to bring it into Rimrock Kia in Billings, MT. So last Monday (March 14, 2011), I brought it in. This time, I said that I wanted to go for a test drive with the tech who would work on the vehicle. We got in and he (the tech) hooked up a computer to the vehicle's port. He ran the diagnostics program and we proceeded to head off the lot. I turned onto a side street, and waited at a stop sign to turn right. I waited for traffic to ease, and then got on the main street. I immediately "jumped on it", giving about 80% push on the pedal. At this time, I was probably doing about 20 or 25 mph. When I depressed the pedal, sure enough, the engine stalled out and the tech was completely surprised. I had to pull into the center lane and into a parking lot, since I knew the vehicle would die at any moment. Once I let up on the gas, the engine eventually recovered (in the parking lot). The tech said to pull back onto the street.

TBC...
 

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2009 Kia Borrego
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Discussion Starter #22
I pulled back onto 24th street. I turned left onto Kings Ave. I got to the entrance ramp for I-90 West. The tech said to go ahead an make it happen again. I jumped on the gas and the engine stalled. I had to pull onto the shoulder--the engine almost died.

The tech said he was checking the pedal % versus the throttle %. At one point, he said the pedal was 30% and the throttle read 100%!

He was checking other things like the o2 sensors too. The tech had me repeat the issue time and time again. And, like clockwork, the engine would stall out every time I tried to accelerate (like going from 65 to 75 mph). In all, I would say that we got the engine to stall out at least a dozen times. Each time, (and remember, I'm on the interstate where the speed limit is 75 mph), I would have to pull off onto the shoulder because of the stalling engine. On at least one occassion, the engine shut off completely and I lost all power.

Two statements by the technician were very telling:
1) They may have to get a Kia Engineer involved!
2) As he stated to the Service Consultant (i.e. his boss) later on, "the vehicle is UNDRIVEABLE"!

So, after nearly a year of driving the vehicle under these conditions, and having taken it in for servicing previously on at least 5 different occassions, I was told that the vehicle was, in fact, undriveable!

Oh, and one more thing...
The tech asked what gas I was using. I said, that, based on what I was told by the service manager in Colorado back in July, 2010, I was only using 87 octane. The tech then told me that I should use at least mid-grade gas, if not premium, since the vehicle would certainly run BETTER using higher grade gas. I agreed, and I said that the suggestion to use the 87 grade was, to me, rediculous.

Finally, the tech told me something that has me utterly scared to drive the vehicle. He said that these Kia's are equipped with the anti-take-off safety feature, and that he feels that the engine is BEING TOLD TO STOP by the computer! In case you're not aware, the anti-take-off feature is put in place due to the Toyota problems where vehicles would accelerate unintentionally.

For example, if both pedals are being pressed for a certain length of time, then the engine will be told to shut down. As far as this tech is concerned, he feels that this is what is happening when I attempt to accelerate with the pedal down over 30, 40, or maybe 50% (no one really knows).

TBC...
 

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2009 Kia Borrego
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Discussion Starter #23
But, wait, there's more:

This winter, on at least 3 occassions, the engine will die while idling. First, while my wife was in line at the McDonald's drive through in Cody, WY, the engine died. She had to try several times to get it to restart.

More recently, on two separate occassions in the Walmart parking lot, after sitting and idlling for about an hour, we would pull out of the parking lot and onto the street, and the truck would sputter and die. The first time, it happened at about 2am. I pulled onto the street and the truck sputtered and died. A cop actually turned around to see why I was pulled over in the street. After several attempts, and after waiting a few minutes, the engine finally "caught" and restarted. Both times that this happened, the gas tank was farily low (but not empty).

In case you're wondering why I'd sit idling in the parking lot, it's because my wife would do the shopping while I waited in the truck with the sleeping baby. Also, it's about 10 degrees outside, so, yes, I keep it running.

And then, finally, there's the issue with the GPS/Audio control unit. Since about September (or perhaps earlier) last year, the large GPS/Audio control screen has a tendency to lock up and freeze. At first, I would say that it would happen once or twice a day. What happens is that the screen will completely lock up and become unresponsive. Usually, after a minute or two, the computer will reboot (the screen will say "KIA"). Then, everything works okay again. As the months went by, it would happen more and more. Now, the screen freezes and reboots about every 30 seconds!

TBC...

In fact, I've seen messages pop up that say "Windows Fatal Application Error". Of course, in this vehicle, that screen controls everything from Sirius satellite, to your USB device, to the CD player, and of course the GPS! Sometimes, while using the GPS to get to a place I've never been, I've actually had to pray that the screen wouldn't freeze up, or, that when it did reboot, that I would have enough time before my next turn or exit would come up!
 

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2009 Kia Borrego
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Discussion Starter #24 (Edited)
Fast forward to today:
I got a call from Kia saying that it's ready to be picked up.

They said they've replaced some sensors on Banks 1 & 2, and two o2 sensors. Also the service manager said that "when you pin it, there's a rev limiter"....

Then he said what I've heard from these dealers about 30 times now: "You know, it's got an $11,000 BMW transmission". Gee, previously I was told that it had a $15,000 BMW transmission! This led me to ask whether they had really road tested the vehicle using the same techniques that we (me and their tech) had used last Monday? I believe he said "probably not".

There's a common thread in all of this, since the problems with my Kia Borrego began. And that is, that they (the dealerships) always want to try to blame the consumer first, for the problems. So, far, I've been told that:
1) You're using too high an octane of gas, and that I should ONLY use 87.
2) You're using the incorrect oil (5w30 instead of 5w20).
3) You're using too low an octane of gas (try using higher octane).
4) You're over-revving the engine (insinuating that I don't know how to drive). But wait, it's an automatic with a 6 speed $15,000 BMW tranny! How could you possibly over-rev the engine by stepping on the gas pedal?!!!

So now they want me to drive up tomorrow to get my vehicle (200 miles r/t). I told him that before I go up there, he needs to get the technician to test drive the vehicle the same way as before, to guarantee that they have indeed fixed the problem. Then, if all is okay, I will pick it up.

As a sidenote, the dealership is paying for a rental while the truck is in for repair. The rental happens to be a Kia Sedona (van). But there's only a 150 mile per day coverage. So if I go up there tomorrow and it still exhibits the same problem, I will have to drive 200 miles r/t, exceeding their daily limit.

BTW, I floored the pedal on the Sedona while merging onto I-90 and guess what, no issues with stalling.;)

NOTE: The speaker noise was eventually fixed by KIA in Billings (several months ago)...the ground wire was not connected to the amplifier.
 

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14 Kia Sorento (V6 EX AWD), 2013 Nissan Altima SV
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what is amazing

What is amazing it that none of the things they told you (octane, etc) would cause the symptoms that you are having. Here's hoping for the best (for you). But like you, based on what I read, I have little faith in your dealership. Fortunately, my Kia service dept is top notch, although the sales dept sucks. I got so tired of dealing with them, I ended up driving 75 miles to buy my borrego from a different dealer.

Fast forward to today:
I got a call from Kia saying that it's ready to be picked up.

They said they've replaced some sensors on Banks 1 & 2, and two o2 sensors. Also the service manager said that "when you pin it, there's a rev limiter"....

Then he said what I've heard from these dealers about 30 times now: "You know, it's got an $11,000 BMW transmission". Gee, previously I was told that it had a $15,000 BMW transmission! This led me to ask whether they had really road tested the vehicle using the same techniques that we (me and their tech) had used last Monday? I believe he said "probably not".

There's a common thread in all of this, since the problems with my Kia Borrego began. And that is, that they (the dealerships) always want to try to blame the consumer first, for the problems. So, far, I've been told that:
1) You're using too high an octane of gas, and that I should ONLY use 87.
2) You're using the incorrect oil (5w30 instead of 5w20).
3) You're using too low an octane of gas (try using higher octane).
4) You're over-revving the engine (insinuating that I don't know how to drive). But wait, it's an automatic with a 6 speed $15,000 BMW tranny! How could you possibly over-rev the engine by stepping on the gas pedal?!!!

So now they want me to drive up tomorrow to get my vehicle (200 miles r/t). I told him that before I go up there, he needs to get the technician to test drive the vehicle the same way as before, to guarantee that they have indeed fixed the problem. Then, if all is okay, I will pick it up.

As a sidenote, the dealership is paying for a rental while the truck is in for repair. The rental happens to be a Kia Sedona (van). But there's only a 150 mile per day coverage. So if I go up there tomorrow and it still exhibits the same problem, I will have to drive 200 miles r/t, exceeding their daily limit.

BTW, I floored the pedal on the Sedona while merging onto I-90 and guess what, no issues with stalling.;)
 

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2009 Kia Borrego
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Discussion Starter #26 (Edited)
Thanks, Rick:

We drove 1400 miles to purchase this vehicle back in 2009. There were no EX-V8's with the options and color in an 8 state area (out west).

I am afraid to say that I believe that, at this point, the dealerships are following KIA's orders, and that the poor service that I've received so far, is KIA-wide. The fact is that my experiences and disappointments come from 3 different dealerships. They ALL lie. They ALL make things up just to get you to leave. There seems to be no one at KIA that says, hey, the buck stops here!

What it gets down to, is if you have a serious problem, KIA simply may or may not ALLOW your service techs to diagnose and work on the problem! If KIA says no, then you're S.O.L.

When I purchased the Borrego, I bought the extended 100,000 mile warranty. The funny thing about guarantees is, as Tommy Boy would say, "all you have is a guaranteed piece of s**t".

FYI, did you know that "Kia Motors Says Vice Chairman Jeong Resigned on Sept. 3, After Car Recalls" and that "Kia will recall about...8,000 Mohave SUV's...The vehicles were made between September 2009 and July this year..."

And, also:
"The company will recall another 18,147 Sorento, Borrego, and Soul models in China because of problems with circuit boards, the General Administration of Quality Supervision, Inspection, and Quarantine said in a statement on its website yesterday".

Funny...they are all made in Korea, but no recalls posted in the U.S.?

artworkz:
Yes, many times. In fact, after the debacle on our Utah "vacation", I chewed them out pretty good, saying that the CO dealership had done absolutely nothing for us, and in fact, charged us for a service that didn't help anything. Further, KIA consumer affairs really has never cared at all about the problem...they side with KIA. Whenever I speak to anyone at KIA roadside assistance, all they care about is whether I need to be towed.
 

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2009 Kia Borrego EX V8
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Please keep us updated if the Kia dealer finally fixed the problem this time. I assume they did. By the way, the rev limiter should not be the "rev killer"
 

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14 Kia Sorento (V6 EX AWD), 2013 Nissan Altima SV
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I feel for ya man, Ours has been in 2 different shops 15 or so times in 18 months and they've still never fixed the problems. Ours has never had your problem though, you can floor it and it goes.
Ours has the trans lock up problem and was towed in the first time 3 days after we bought it and they still haven't fixed anything.
I feel for you all. I have 24k miles now and no problems other than warped rotors which were replaced under warranty. I am enjoying my Borrego. I just wish you guys could do the same. Good luck.
 
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