Timing Belt? Interference or not?

jlahood · 12-05-2012, 12:57 PM

My 03 spectra stalled at a stop sign. Wouldn't start after that. Sounded like the starter was not engaging. Pulled it out and had it tested. Tested good.

Could it be my timing belt. 197000 miles it has never been changed. I took the top timing belt cover off and found a small piece of the belt that goes in between the teeth on the gear. Tried to pull on the belt but it is tight. If it is broke wouldn't I be able to pull it out?
Is this an interference motor. I called the dealer and they said it definetly was. How can I check to see if it is in fact the belt and if there is any damage to the engine. If the engine is damaged I don't want to sink money into it.

DavesSpectra · 12-05-2012, 01:23 PM

Check this thread out...
http://www.kia-forums.com/shuma-spec...irmed-non.html
Dave

jlahood · 12-06-2012, 05:25 PM

I got the timing belt off and it was pretty much stripped of any ridges on the bottom crankshaft gear. Should I be able to turn the camshaft gears by hand? I tried to move them and they are tight.
I sent an email to Kia motors and they called me today and said it is an interference motor. I just want to be sure there is no damage before I spend money on trying to fix it.
Any help would be very appreciated.

DavesSpectra · 12-07-2012, 01:01 AM

Replied in a pm to jlahood
Looks like it's gone..
Dave

jlahood · 12-07-2012, 08:03 AM

I can turn the crankshaft by hand. The sparkplugs were fine. The pistons move. My question is should I be able to turn the to camshaft gears at the top of the motor by hand.

DavesSpectra · 12-07-2012, 09:24 AM

I am replying to you via pm...
Really that's why we should be doing it here...
Lot's of confusion for you/I/others and the info passed is not shown here for others to learn by.
I may compress the pms (if OK by you) and post them here for others to "see" and understand what's going down...
Dave

jlahood · 12-07-2012, 06:35 PM

Sounds good. Sorry to you and all. That was my mistake. I will post here from now on.
Thanks for all your help.

DavesSpectra · 12-07-2012, 08:12 PM

Here's what's been going on behind the scene for you avid readers...
Quote
"[QUOTE=jlahood]Dave,
I am reaching out to you as you are the only one who has responded to my
original posting.
I got the timing belt off and the belt was stripped/bald of any ridges on the
bottom crankshaft gear. Should I be able to turn the camshaft gears by hand? I
tried to move them and they are tight.
I sent an email to Kia motors and they called me today and said it is an
interference motor. I just want to be sure there is no damage before I spend
money on trying to fix it.
Any help would be very appreciated.

[QUOTE=DavesSpectra]jlahood...
You said "I got the timing belt off and the belt was stripped/bald of any ridges
on the bottom crankshaft gear. Should I be able to turn the camshaft gears by
hand? I tried to move them and they are tight."
OUCH!!!
You should be able to move the crank (by had) to a very limited degree (one
maybe two teeth)..Even that is dangerous..
The very first thing I'd do is pull the spark plugs and see if the center
electrode is damaged on any of them.. Usually when the major damage happens the
valves snap off and hit the plugs and smash the electrodes. The valves can also
go through the top of the pistons.

Do the timing marks line up on the cam and crank pulleys? ( I doubt it BTW).
You post of the starter motor not being able to move the engine is another BAD
sign.

To sum it up
1 Timing belt stripped of teeth
2 crank won't turn
3 starter can't turn over the engine
4 KIA says it's an interference type engine

Looks like you will be looking for another car soon... or an engine at least..
With 186k miles on it...It served you well...It would have gone longer "if" you
had replaced the TB... I see this type of post here all the time...

You can do a car autopsy—(also known as a post-mortem examination). Remove the
head and confirm the damage.
Sorry...
Dave

[QUOTE=jlahood]Dave,
Let me correct myself. The starter turns the motor over. I can turn the
crankshaft by hand. I pulled the plugs and the were fine.

My question is should I be able to turn the 2 camshaft gears at the top of the
motor by hand.

The timing marks are very close to
being right on. If they were one tooth over they would line up with the
alignment marks.
I also looked in the spark plug hole and didn't see any damage. Turned the crank
and the pistons move.
why is it dangerous to move the crank by hand?
Thanks for your help.

Good Morning!
I just got up (retired) and checked the mail.
Now for the answers..
What you say sounds good... BUT..
Withe the valves open on ANY of the 4 cylinders...your turning the crank
(pulley) is raising the pistons one by one to top dead center (TDC). A truley
"interference" type engine WILL eventually find the WRONG sequence and smash the
open valves with that piston...
The cam shaft pulley(s) directly drive the valves and they are spring loaded (to
force them closed)..so you will have some restriction on cam movement and the
turning of the cam pulley...If you have NO movement of the cam pulley...pull the
head cover and see WHY..
I have two Spectras (06 mine/07 wifes) and the 2.0L (beta version) has one cam
pulley (exhaust valves) that on the other end drives the intake cam by/via a
drive chain... Some earlier KIA engines (sportage) have both cams
(intake/exhaust) driven by the TB and the arrangement looks like Micky Mouse's
ears and have NO timing chain on the other end... I have not worked on the pre
2004.5 year 1.8L engine but I believe they have the single pulley driven by the
TB and the chain on the other end. I just want you to understand the layouts.

You may have "top end" (head) problems such as frozen cam bearings/ damaged
chain drive/etc causing the cam pulley not to turn. That's why pulling the head
cover will probably be needed to "see" the problem(s).. This would also make
sense of the teeth being chewed off of the bottom side of the TB. (crank turning
but cam not).
Let me know what you find...
Dave

[QUOTE=jlahood]Dave,
Thanks for the help and for answering so quickly. I did move both cams just a small bit to line them up with the timing marks. I am going to buy a belt kit and water pump tomorrow and install it. I will let you know if the timing marks are still in place after I rotate the engine. Your posts were very clear and were in order. Thanks again. I have my fingers crossed."
19:30 friday Dec 97,2012
Unquote

Dave

jlahood · 12-08-2012, 02:53 PM

After further inspection my camshaft timing marks are at about the nine oclock position. Can I rotate them with a wrench to the correct position?
I am at a stand still until I get an answer.

DavesSpectra · 12-08-2012, 08:35 PM

I would say yes...Pull the plugs (to reduce friction from compression). Just take it slow/easy and if you encounter any heavy resistance...investigate why.
Taking it easy means you won't bend valves "if" things are way out of sync.
You might "push" a piston down with the valve but probably won't damage anything at that slow a pace.
You can also put a 1/4" wood dowel rod in #1 cylinder and "see" (the dowel rod will move up to the highest point) when the crank is TDC (top dead center) and the timing marks match up on the crank.
Dave