2001 Carnival oxygen sensor problem

[hazza96]

I have a 2001 model Carnival and it has an oxygen sensor problem that has the mechanic scratching his head. Heres what happens:

1. Start the car.
2. Idle as long as you want, no error thrown.
3. Rev the car in neutral, let it idle, no error.
4. Drive the car anything between 100 meters or 20 minutes, no error.
5. Stop the car and keep the revs above 1,000 no error.
6. Let the car idle for approx 15 seconds, error indicator lights up.
7. Light stays on no matter what.
8. Turn the car off, clears the indicator light.
9. Go to step 1.

Our engine basically blew up because of the known fault with this engine of the cylinder sleeves slipping down. Even though it was just out of warranty Kia replaced it for us. When that happened we also got the "O2 sensor" code. That time it turned out to be a faulty vacuum hose to the throttle body.

This time the mechanic checked all the hoses and has replaced the bank 1 (front one) oxygen sensor already. I don't know if the old one had the same pattern of when the light coming on because it's the wifes car and she didn't notice the pattern.

I watched while they had the computer connected to the car and the bank 2 sensor was giving the signal it is supposed to, up, down, up down, up.... B1 is just a flat line but the computer does not give an error code until the car is driven for a bit.

Has anyone seen this problem before? Does anyone have any clues as to what could be causing the problem? We just had the timing belt changed, just after the mechanic dropped off the car my wife came to pick me up and it gave this error. Could they have damaged something (like a hose) while they were doing the timing belt and that is the cause of my problem?

Do Kia have a database of these weird type of issues that dealers/mechanics can search on so that they don't have to re-invent the wheel?

[sgarlic]

Well, the PCM itself could be bad.. but that's not likely.

If the tech has already replaced the oxygen sensor, he should datalog the readings he's getting from it, and be sure it matches what the FSM calls for.

Also, an exhaust leak, can cause o2 sensor codes.

[Carnivore]

I have just replace my front (B1) O2 sensor due to non responsiveness, it stays flat when showed in the computer. Luckily it was under warranty and has been in for 3 months only. Funny thing is, i have a badly leaking exhaust too (Far back though), however right now there is no more error codes.
Why don't you check the mass air flow sensor as well, as that could cause problem too (In=out). If not correct in, out will be too.

Also what kind of error codes it is giving you?

[Classic boy]

The engine management system uses internal 'monitors' and these monitors sometimes only check data or set a fault after a drive cycle.

Type OBD2 and drive cycle in a search engine for more info about the various monitors and drive cycles.

But a O2 sensor should not show no output, if the sensor is renewed then I would have them check the wiring between the computer and the sensor.

[hazza96]

Originally Posted by Classic boy

But a O2 sensor should not show no output, if the sensor is renewed then I would have them check the wiring between the computer and the sensor.

That's what I suspected, I will get them to check the wiring, thanks.

[hazza96]

Originally Posted by hazza96

That's what I suspected, I will get them to check the wiring, thanks.

They checked the wiring and did not find a problem. I think I will take it to a KIA dealer, it will be more expensive but this issue is starting to get VERY annoying.

[Schnauzer]

Originally Posted by hazza96

Do Kia have a database of these weird type of issues that dealers/mechanics can search on so that they don't have to re-invent the wheel?

Yes, Kia and its parent Hyundai have several technical ventures for their dealer service network to get detailed information from regional to HQ. The service manager is only a call or email away from expertise in the field or in Corporate. Some service managers may not avail themselves of all the resources but that is not Corporate's fault. Some have ego problems and do not like appearing not knowledgable but this is rare I think. Most will go the distance to find answers. In rare cases, Kia HQ has been known to send technical teams to investigate a possible serious issue that got pass QC and engineering.

[hazza96]

It turns out the previous mechanic had screwed up the timing belt replacements. One belt was out by one tooth, another by two and the third belt was out by three.

Thankfully it wasn't enough to damage the motor just enough for us to spend AUS$1,200 tracking down their fuck up. $370 for a replacement O2 sensor and $830 for the KIA dealer to find what was actually wrong with it.

The mech that replaced the timing belts claims he had his guy double check the timing belts but I plan on getting them to refund the O2 sensor cost AND pay for the real problem to be found and fixed.

[cpapashley]

Originally Posted by hazza96

It turns out the previous mechanic had screwed up the timing belt replacements. One belt was out by one tooth, another by two and the third belt was out by three.

Thankfully it wasn't enough to damage the motor just enough for us to spend AUS$1,200 tracking down their fuck up. $370 for a replacement O2 sensor and $830 for the KIA dealer to find what was actually wrong with it.

The mech that replaced the timing belts claims he had his guy double check the timing belts but I plan on getting them to refund the O2 sensor cost AND pay for the real problem to be found and fixed.

So who was the mechanic and in which location. Not much sense giving a general complaint. If this is actually what ocurred then post their name as well with the simple facts or whatever. Others in australia need to know not to take their Kia Carnivals (at least) to this mechanic.